BOYD - Attack On Cannon's Foot Discussion

[K Man]

Hero said:

[ooc: Was there anything we could have done to prevent this? We're up against wizards that are much more powerful than us and a horde of trolls that are much more powerful than us. My options seem to be A) run or B) die. Did I miss something?]

I wanted to start a thread here to discuss this. I hope everyone here doesn't think me a rail-roader...I hate that moniker. So I wanted to open discussion of Options and thoughts on this attack and how to survive it.

First off, what was SUPPOSED to happen was; Krysta, Girud, Galdren and the Elves had a choice of were to go. They chose Cannon's Foot. Had they not chosen Cannon's Foot, Fortress-Breaker would have fired fine, sending the Shard to 'The Glade'. About 90% of 'The SlaughterFog' would have left to give chase and the remaining 10% would've given you a difficult fight, but not overwhelming like this.

Now, that said, it is not the way it happened. The Elves showed up and stole the crystal, effectively messing up the entire group's day. I see some of the options as this;

1) Stay and fight it out. The Shamans really have a meager spell line-up to start an initial attack, and you are in a town more armed than any city in the Southern US. It could get ugly, but hey...anyone remember Boon's Freehold? Ya'll survived that one too.
2) Run. Viable and one could return here shortly after that battle if they wish.
3) Get to the mages and force them to help...with the end of your sword.
4) See what Delomme has in store.
5) Find a way to help everyone else survive. Are there giant barrels we can squeeze townspeople into and fire towards 'The Glade'? Then get the Druids to help slowdown the projectiles so that they don't get pulped on impact?
6) Hide and see if you can avoid the Fog when it gets into the city.
7) Surrender...

The list goes on. Sorry if I seem to railroad, I don't mean to...

So let's talk about how to survive here.

[TheUdjat]

Right, if they hadn't gone to Cannon's Foot, this wouldn't have happened. But you are, then, agreeing that once the elves appeared there was no way to avoid it? That's still pretty troubling.

Onto your points:

1. We will die if we stand and fight. You mentioned multiple shamans. Even a few fireballs have decimated the city's defenses. If they had NO shamans, then maybe we'd have had a chance. But with the entire city surrounded by a circle at least a hundred feet deep (as you said) of trolls (CR 5, I believe, and oh yeah they regenerate), I don't think there's a realistic chance for survival. The fog is only even blown away from one portion of that. We have a lot of firepower, but I don't think it's enough. At least, not from the way things have been described thus far.
2. What good would returning be?
3. The mages are doing a good job of exhausting all their useful spells on escaping. That earth elemental could've been a good combatant (though a fire elemental, admittedly, would've been better). Regardless, these are 13th level characters we're talking about, and highly uncooperative ones. They were not meant for our benefit. and we have no idea what level the elven elite that would attack us if we threatened them are.
4. I'm looking into that one, though it looks like he wants to destroy Fortress Breaker, at first guess.
5. I thought about this, but based on the blast we saw for the crystal, I don't think anybody would survive that. And I don't know about the druids, nor do I have any idea, magically speaking, how they would slow their descent.
6. They can see in the fog and we can't. This doesn't sound like a great idea.
7. Surrender is just not an option. Period.

We tried to defend Boon's Freehold, yeah. But we ran from that, too. We just had an excellent way to decimate the army by destroying the Freehold itself before we left. Maybe we can do that here, but even in that we lose. These aren't orcs and goblins. These things can survive massive blasts.

It is a significant challenge for characters our level to take on just two trolls, without their magic. To take on hundreds with people lining the walls that, for all intents and purposes, are probably low-level warriors? Defense will not work.

I still think it's run or die. Maybe an ingenius run, but a run.

...But we might still be able to get the crystal. Because that earth elemental can only go so far before his spell runs out, and he'll have to deposit it somewhere. Probably on the surface. And I know exactly how to locate it...

[Japic]

I already decided my actions. It seems to me that my sword against all the magics and the hoarde is not very balanced.

As I said before they betrayal of us all though, they were gonna do something. They feel justified in their actions, they are doing as bade by their queen. You have to know that they weren't just gonna let it get fired off without any trouble.

Looking at their method though, it would have been even more interesting if they had shaped the wall of force to basically turn the crystal in a different direction. Still let the power of the cannon do the work, but send it some where else than the glade. Imagine if you will a curved wall that turns it midair (either 45 or maybe even a 90 degree turn) that would have been strange to see.

If they had done that the fog could not attack in force, without breaking their word. According to KMan's post above the main force would have broken off to persue the crystal.

Oh well, what's done is done.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Yeah, the uncooperation of the elves is very disheartening. If Krysta had the chance, she would leave their sorry asses right now. But she knows there is no other way out of this place, as the other group has the luxury of teleporting themselves anywhere at will. Did I stress ANYWHERE???

As for Galdren and Girud, they are fighters, and the trolls have magic. And with the FireBall blasts, that effectively would have destroyed a LOT of personnel that would be manning the massive weapons...so what good are weapons if they are not able to be manned?

Looks like there is only one option. Run. But I would still like to have a chance for Delomme to escape. He is more than likely the mastermind behind the weapons, and can help Ravenshead in their defenses. Plus, if he can meet up with the dwarf that devised vein riding....imagine weapons firing through the veins at targets across the world..... ;D

But, it looks like the party is split again. I wish it was on better terms, but it's not. Krysta is pissed...but is seemingly helpless. Almost like a pawn in a chessgame. With the queen dead, the prince would take the throne....and he has a better understanding (not much better, but he realizes the corruption in his mother) of what needs to be done.

But again, that is probably not a viable option, as whomever did that would surely die...(Martyr???)

[TheUdjat]

Oh yeah, and I don't think you're a Rail Roader, KMan, I just assumed we're supposed to be stuck in lots of hopeless situations as a flavor element of the campaign. Like, you intend for this to seem like a hopeless war. That's all.

[K Man]

Oh yeah, and I don't think you're a Rail Roader, KMan, I just assumed we're supposed to be stuck in lots of hopeless situations as a flavor element of the campaign. Like, you intend for this to seem like a hopeless war.

Thanks Udjat, and it is...to a degree. But it's definetely a war that CAN and most likely WILL be won. It will have its downturns...hell, look at The Empire Strikes Back

as the other group has the luxury of teleporting themselves anywhere at will. Did I stress ANYWHERE

Sort of. The caveat is that it can only be outdoors, on uncovered earth. From Earth to Earth...not through stone, through magic barriers, into castles etc.

Besides, it's not limited to this group. In time, I hope to have all of you 'Vein-Riding'. Assuming we get over the differences of course.

Good discussion people

[VemuKhaham]

No I hate the word railroading and right now I think it even doesn't apply. Basically all Kman does is illustrate reality. Well, the evil powers in the world could have decided to send 'an army of EL8', about up to par with what you could handle. That doesn't sound very logical, but it certainly would be comical. I like it the way it goes now. Of course my character isn't there to feel the frustration of facing almost certain defeat, (Romar would flip) but still sometimes it's good to face the players with the facts. I would almost found it boring if you managed to fight of the enemy right now, just because you six heroes are there to save the day.

What I mean to say is: I like the way Kman runs things right now. He does it as I think he should've. I mean the set-up is just awsome: intrige from the elves, tension rising from the fog, mystery from the fog also, multiple groups all having their own motives, and I'm not only talking of the elven mages, and now the ultimate ethics decisions to leave and live (for some even with the ones they hate the most right now) or stay and probably die, but die with those they fought with and couldn't flee as easily. That's just good stuff. And indeed Kman points out that options are even now only limited by imagination.

Great job for that Kman!

[Hero]

I don't think you are railroading. Railroading would have been to force all 12 of us to stay together and that sort of thing. I just don't see any really viable options right now (but then, I just have a sword). Hero is ready to stay and die defending the city. Right now she's going to help Delomne because that seems more useful than being one more archer on the walls. I was just wondering if we had missed some obvious opportunity.

BTW, could we vein ride to fight the elemental?

[K Man]

It's cool Hero, I just wanted to explain myself. It's all going somewhere...trust me;)

As for 'Vein-Riding' - I should explain a bit more. It's not that you melt into the Earth and remain whole while tearing through terra, it's that you are transformed into a string of particles. Think of it like prehistoric beaming. You can only go where there is ore. So no popping up in the middle of the ocean...unless it's at the bottom. No popping up through a stone floor into the heart of a castle, or at the top of a wooden tower. only open earth. You also cannot pop up where there is something already occupying the space. If you do, I'll treat is as a 'shunt' from dimension door...you take damage and are shifted aside.

Hope that helps.

[TheUdjat]

....Is there ore in an earth elemental? Because it would really rock for us all to pop out through him.

I can see it now...

Earth elemental pops up out of the ground, carrying the crystal. Suddenly it stops, staggers a bit, and then explodes in about 6 individuals spots.

The crystal drops to the ground and the dust settles to reveal the party standing around it.

That would totally rock. No pun intended.

[BluSpecs]

Sounds good to me

what do you think kman?

[K Man]

of course there is ore in an elemental.

PCKILLINGDEATHOREBIUM

Or #33 in the Role-Playminide series of elements.

Seriously though, that would be pretty bad-ass to see.

[TheUdjat]

K said:

Seriously though, that would be pretty bad-ass to see.

Saying that is tantamount to inviting us to do it.

[Hero]

Whoo HOO! Blowing up trolls! I love the fact that they leave behind a bloody mist - nice touch.

[K Man]

Can't think of anything else they would leave behind with that kind of damage instaneously...

There has to be some kind of testament to their existence and if a bloody spray is all I can manage, then damnit, the Trolls will get their mist!

By the way Hero, I noticed I'm quoted twice in your sig...thanks, I think.

[Wizard]

You know, Kman, it took me a while to find out the meaning of Cajone, 'cause it's not English...nice touch, but no WAY am I playing a paladin who (for the rest of the campaign) is called Callian, He Who Has Balls.

[Japic]

Wizard said:

You know, Kman, it took me a while to find out the meaning of Cajone, 'cause it's not English...nice touch, but no WAY am I playing a paladin who (for the rest of the campaign) is called Callian, He Who Has Balls.

I think it's a nice touch. and the tales will spread regardless of what you've said or done. That's what heroes get. Names that folks recall them by. Eventually they memory will slip and your name will begin to be forgotten untiol oneday you'll only be known as Nutz.

Or atleast that's my perspective on things.

[VemuKhaham]

I didn't understand Cajone either, but I thought it was just because my English isn't as good as yours and my dictionary sucks. But if it's not English what is it then? I would almost say an indian language, guessing by the translation.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Italian/Spanish term...very amusing!!! I keep forgetting of the different cultures here on the boards...I thought everyone knew what it meant.

[Japic]

Not to detract from the grandness of Mr. Cajone over there, but that city just got uber screwed up!

I wonder if that's how the Master plans to win. By allowing all the life to kill itsself and blow their own defenses to shreds.


Either way, damn. This should be interesting. You are still at teh city, and we're going back to teh city. The battle for this shard is not yet concluded.


Oh yeah, and now Romar's gonna be turned too. This isn't lookling good for our intrepid adventurers.