Sorceror Level 7 Spells?

[Fangor the Fierce]

Ok, so with my dragon slayer now going level 14 sorceror, he gains a single level 7 spell to use up to 4 times per day. Here's my thoughts on that:

I could take Greater Teleport, which is sorely needed. NO more mistakes, no more miss chances, and easier to get places. If I take it, I can trade out Teleport for another level 5 spell. Against dragons, what level 5 spells would be good? Options that I am thinking if are:

Cloudkill -
Creates a 20’ radius Spread by 20’ high Cloud of yellowish fog that moves 10’ per round away from its caster. Living creatures in the
cloud take the following effect each round:
6+ HD: 1d4 Constitution Damage (Fort½)
4-5 HD: Death (Fort save for 1d4 Con dmg)
0-3 HD: Death (no save).
A creature is affected even if holding its breath. The vapors are heavier than air & will sink into an opening in the ground, like an ant hill.

Prismatic Ray -
The target of the Ranged Touch attack is:
a) Blind for 2d4 rounds, unless 7HD+; and
b) The target is effected by one random color:
d6 Color Effect
1 Red 20hp Fire damage (Ref½)
2 Orange 40hp Acid damage (Ref½)
3 Yellow 80hp Electricity damage (Ref½)
4 Green Poison – Death (Fort½ 1d6Con)
5 Blue Turned to Stone (FortNeg)
6 Indigo Insanity (as spell) (WillNeg)

Hold Monster -
One living creature is Held. It gets a new Will save each round to end the spell.

Or anything else I forgot?

Second Option is to take something else for my 7th level spell, and simply replacing Assay Resistance (level 4 spell) with something else.

Level 7 Spells I like:

Forcecage -
Creates a six-sided box of invisible force walls. The walls is immune to all damage & most magic (including Dispel Magic). The cube can be of two configurations:
a) Barred Cage – 20’ cube with 6” bands of force alternating with 6” gaps; or
b) Windowless Cell – 10’ cube with six solid walls.
Teleportation & Astral travel can escape the spell, but not spells based on Ethereal travel.

Emerald Flame Fist(CArc p105)
<Evoc[fire], VS, 1StdAct, Touch, 1rnd/lvl, SR applies>
– One of the caster’s hands is surrounded by green flame, which gives off 20’ radius of light. On a successful Touch attack, a target creature
or object takes 3d6 + 1 per Caster level (max 3d6+20) Fire damage (no save) and has the green fire move from the caster’s hand to his/her body (FortNeg). If the flame is no longer on the caster’s hand, the target takes 3d6 + 1 per Caster level (max 3d6 + 20) Fire damage each round (Fort½) until the spell’s duration ends.

Prismatic Spray -
Everyone within the 60’ long Cone-shaped Burst suffer the following:
a) Blind for 2d4 rounds, unless 9HD+; and
b) Each subject is hit by 1-2 random colors:
d8 Color Effect
1 Red 20hp fire damage (Ref½)
2 Orange 40hp acid damage (Ref½)
3 Yellow 80hp electricity damage (Ref½)
4 Green Poison – Death (Fort½ 1d6Con)
5 Blue Turned to Stone (FortNeg)
6 Indigo Insanity (as spell) (WillNeg)
7 Violet Plane Shift (as spell) (WillNeg)
8 2 colors Roll twice, ignoring ‘8’s.

Sword of Darkness(CArc p126) -
<Necro[evil], VSM(longsword)F(large stone), 1StdAct,
Medium-range, 1rnd/lvl(D), no save, SR applies>
– Creates a black blade of negative energy that attacks the caster’s opponents without need for attention.
a) Attacks its target automatically with an attack bonus equal to its Caster level. The sword can make a Standard Attack on the round it is created;
b) By making a Full Round attack, the sword can make multiple attacks as appropriate for its attack bonus;
c) Does 1 Negative Level each time it hits a living creature. The sword threat range of 19-20 & does 2 Negative Levels on a critical hit. The Negative Levels fade when the spell ends, but it a creature takes as many Negative Levels as its HD, it dies;
e) An Undead struck by the sword gains 5 Temporary HP per two levels (max 25 hp) that fade after 1 hour. d) If the sword attacks a creature with Spell Resistance, it gets one check to dispel the sword. If it fails, the sword can attack that target freely.
e) The caster can change the sword’s target as a Standard Action. On such a round, it can only do a Standard Attack;
f) Attacks from the caster’s direction, but can give Flanking bonuses to the caster’s allies;
g) The sword cannot be damaged, but can be Dispelled.

{I don't like the XP penalty... but here's another}
Limited Wish(PH p248)
<Univ, VSX(300), 1StdAct>
– The caster may cast any one spell, even from another class’ spell list & even from a prohibited school of magic, The spell has all the normal restrictions, such as allowing a saving throw, except that it is
treated as a 7th level spell & any material components worth less than 1,000gp can be ignored.
This spell can also be used to break harmful spells, such as Insanity and Geas/Quest.

So, anyone have some help to lend me? I am a little green on sorcerors, and I don't want to overlook something I might have missed/not understand.

[Deekin]

Some other options

From the Draconomicon

7th-

Hide From Dragons- Dragons cannot perceive once subject per 2 levels.

Energy Immunity- Immune to one energy type

Anti-magic Ray- Target looses all magical powers

5th- Vunerablity- Reduces oppents Damage Resistance

4th- Anti-dragon Aura- Allies gain bonus to AC and saves vs Dragons.

From Spell Compendium

7th -Stun Ray: Subject stunned 1d4+1 rounds.
Energy Ebb: Give subject one negative level/round
for 1 round/level.

5th-Reciprocal Gyre: Creature or object takes 1d12
damage/level of spell affecting it (max 25d12).
Dimension Door, Greater: Short-range, multipleuse
dimension door.
Fly, Mass: One creature/level flies at speed of 60 ft.
Xorn Movement: Touched creature swims
through earth like a xorn.

[Fangor the Fierce]

I would like to know more about Anti-Dragon Aura, Xorn Movement, Anti-Magic Ray, and of course Hide From Dragons.

Mass Fly, crap, as the dragons are at home in the sky. ON the ground, we own them. Vulnerability is not that great, as DR is not that bad to overcome. Energy Immunity is ok, but not worth taking as sorceror with so many Energy Resistance spells to use up. Stun Ray, not likely. Energy Ebb sounds intruiging... Reciprical Gyre, read it, not too sure on it.

Thanks for the info, should make a decision by tomorrow, hopefully!!!

[Deekin]

Also, if you really don't like what you pick, My New Char has Psionic Reformation as a power known. For the low cost of 25 xp each, You can change your descions you made last time you leveled up.

HIDE FROM DRAGONS
Abjuration
Level: Assassin 4, bard 5, sorcerer/ wizard 7
Components: S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Targets: One creature touched/ 2 levels
Duration: 10 minutes/level (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)Silently you make the motions and the dragon’s scale smolders in your hand. The rising smoke wraps around you and sinks into your skin.


Dragons cannot see, hear, or smell the warded creatures, even with blindsense. They act as though the warded creatures are not there. Warded creatures could stand before the hungriest of red dragons and not be molested or even noticed. If a warded character touches or attacks a dragon or the dragon’s hoard, even with a spell, the spell ends for all recipients.

Material Component: A dragon scale

ANTIMAGIC RAY
Abjuration
Level: Sorcerer/wizard 7
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Effect: Ray
Duration: 1 round/level
Saving Throw: Will negates (object)
Spell Resistance: Yes

As you cast this spell, an invisible ray projects from your fingers. Where it strikes your foe, it ripples across his body, like water spreading across a calm pond.

You must succeed on a ranged touch attack with the ray to
strike a target. The target, if struck, functions as if it were inside an antimagic field (PH 200) if it fails its Will save. If this spell is used against a creature, the subject can’t cast spells or use supernatural or spell-like abilities, nor do such abilities have any effect on the creature. However, the creature can still use spell completion items (such as scrolls) or spell trigger items (such as wands), even though it can’t cast the spells required. If this spell is used against an object, that object’s magical powers are suppressed—including
any spells previously cast and currently in effect on the item, as well as any spells or magical effects targeted on the object during the antimagic ray’s duration. The spell doesn’t affect any objects other than the subject itself, even if those objects are worn, carried by, or in contact with the subject. For instance, if a creature is the target, its equipment remains unaffected.

Material Component: A pinch of iron filings mixed with ruby dust worth 100 gp.

Huh, Antidragon Aura got lowerd in Level in Spell Comendium

ANTIDRAGON AURA
Abjuration
Level: Cleric 3, sorcerer/ wizard 3
Components: V, S, M, DF
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Targets: One creature/ 2 levels, no two of which are
more than 30 ft. apart
Duration: 1 minute/level
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

All subjects gain a +2 luck bonus to Armor Class and on saving throws against the attacks, spells, and special attacks (extraordinary, supernatural, and spell-like) of dragons. This bonus increases by 1 for every four caster levels above 5th (to +3 at 9th, +4 at 13th, and a maximum of +5 at 17th).
Material Component: A chunk of platinum worth at least 25 gp (slightly less than 1 ounce).

XORN MOVEMENT
Transmutation
Level: Sorcerer/wizard 5
Components: V, S, F
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Target: Creature touched
Duration: 1 round/level; see text
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

The subject of this spell can move through natural earth and stone (but not worked stone, brick, or metal) as a xorn does, leaving behind no tunnel or sign of passage. Furthermore, the subject can breathe normally while entombed in earth and natural rock. A move earth spell cast on an area the subject occupies flings it back 30 feet and stuns it for 1 round.
A successful Fortitude save negates the stunning effect.

Xorn movement lasts a minimum of 1 round/level. If the subject has not emerged into a large enough open space to contain its body comfortably when the spell expires, it is shunted off to the nearest such open space, taking 1d6 points of damage per 5 feet so traveled.

Focus: A scale from a xorn’s hide.

[Fangor the Fierce]

With his concept, I think Hide from Dragons is the perfect spell to take. Sorry to the others, as that means if we use Teleport, then there's the chance to have a missed location again.. .lol. Oh well, when I get another 7th level spell, Greater Teleport will be taken!

So, 7th level spell is Hide from Dragons:

HIDE FROM DRAGONS
Abjuration
Level: Assassin 4, bard 5, sorcerer/ wizard 7
Components: S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Targets: One creature touched/ 2 levels
Duration: 10 minutes/level (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)Silently you make the motions and the dragon’s scale smolders in your hand. The rising smoke wraps around you and sinks into your skin.


Dragons cannot see, hear, or smell the warded creatures, even with blindsense. They act as though the warded creatures are not there. Warded creatures could stand before the hungriest of red dragons and not be molested or even noticed. If a warded character touches or attacks a dragon or the dragon’s hoard, even with a spell, the spell ends for all recipients.

Material Component: A dragon scale

I will also be needing to switch out a spell, since this is my even level progression, and I have the option to get rid of any 5th level spell or lower and replace it with something else. Getting rid of Fireball and replacing with AntiDragon Aura.

I don't use fireball, and dragons usually have some resistance to them. He's going for aiding the group, as a whole. Haste, Hide from Dragons, AntiDragon Aura, those should work well together!

So, anyone object or did I overlook something?

[Japic]

I haven't looked at spells of late; but you really need to consider something to help us control the skies. I know there's some sort of anchor spell that would leave him unable to fly and that would be quite useful. Likewise anything you can do to help control the airspace and not leave them with such wide options would be helpful to all.

No specific suggestions, 'cause I'm in a hurry. Bye.

[Deekin]

Something like this?

WINGBIND
Evocation [Force]
Level: Sorcerer/wizard 4
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Target: One creature
Duration: 1 round/level (D)
Saving Throw: Reflex negates
Spell Resistance: Yes

The flying creature lets out a surprised howl and then plummets to the ground, its wings flat against its body and struggling against a green glowing net.

A web of force surrounds the target, entangling it like a net. This spell functions like earthbind (page 76), except that an ensnared creature immediately falls to the ground, taking falling damage.
An entangled creature can escape with a successful Escape Artist check against a DC equal to the save DC of the spell. Like a wall of force (PH 298), this web of force is impervious to most attacks: It is immune to damage of all kinds, cannot be burst with a Strength check, and is unaffected by most spells, including dispel magic. Also like a wall of force, the web is immediately destroyed by disintegrate, a rod of cancellation, a sphere of annihilation, or Mordenkainen’s disjunction.

Which function like

EARTHBIND
Transmutation
Level: Druid 2, sorcerer/wizard 2
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Target: One creature
Duration: 1 minute/level (D)
Saving Throw: Fortitude negates
Spell Resistance: Yes

Your foe will reach you in seconds. You cast this spell, and yellow strips of magical energy loop about its wings, hampering its flight and dragging it to ground.

You hinder the subject creature’s ability to fly (whether through natural or magical means) for the duration of the spell. If the target fails its saving throw, its fly speed (if any) becomes 0 feet. An airborne creature subjected to this spell falls to the ground as if under the effect of a feather fall spell. Even if a new effect would grant the creature the ability to fly, that effect is suppressed for the duration of the earthbind spell. Earthbind has no effect on other
forms of movement, or even on effects that might grant airborne movement without granting a fly speed (such as jumping or levitate or air walk spells).

Or something like

Ectoplasmic Cocoon
Metacreativity
Level: Shaper 3
Display: Auditory and material
Manifesting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./ level)
Target: One Medium or smaller creature
Duration: 1 round/level (D)
Saving Throw: Reflex negates
Power Resistance: No
Power Points: 5

You draw writhing strands of ectoplasm from the Astral Plane that wrap up the subject like a mummy. The subject can still breathe but is otherwise helpless, unable to see outside the cocoon, speak, or take any physical actions. The subject’s nostrils are clear (air passes through the cocoon normally). The subject can execute purely mental actions (such as manifesting powers or casting spells with no verbal, somatic, or material components).

Cutting or damaging the cocoon can free a victim. The cocoon has hardness 8 and 20 hit points. Teleportation and other forms of travel provide a means of escape, but the cocoon extends into the Ethereal Plane, blocking ethereal travel. An ectoplasmic cocoon can’t be affected by dispel psionics, but it can be dismissed with dismiss ectoplasm, or otherwise destroyed by extreme measures or items.

The creature within the cocoon is visible only as a vague shape (substantial enough to interrupt line of sight) and cannot be directly harmed or interacted with unless the cocoon is destroyed. The cocooned creature can be moved normally (the weight of the cocoon is negligible).

A creature that is cocooned while aloft begins to fall immediately, and a creature that is cocooned while swimming or underwater may drown.

Augment

You can augment this power in one or both of the following ways.

1. For every 2 additional power points you spend, this power’s save DC increases by 1.
2. For every 2 additional power points you spend, this power can affect a target one size category larger.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Well, there is another option, besides those, and I haven't had any response from it when I ask. So, here goes:

Wall of Force, can I cast it in the path of a flying dragon, flying full speed, to cause it damage and possible falling damage? I have plenty of walls of force, and if I could cast them at a dragon while flying, it would be SWEET to watch it do a face-plant into an invisible wall.

So, I would then get Scroll of Earthbind (150gp) or Scroll of Wingbind (700gp)

I could KEEP fireball, and then replace Enervation with Wingbind. I could also get rid of Assay Resistance, but that's a tough call. It comes in handy when needing to overcome SR.

[Fangor the Fierce]

So, I can take the 7th level spell, Hide from Dragons, and only replace ONE spell on my list.

So, voting for the spells, here they are:

AntiDragon Aura (+4 to AC, saves vs dragons spells, spell like abilities, etc. Would have to delete Fireball)

vs.

Wingbind (Cause flying dragon to become entangled if REFLEX save fails, dropping from sky. Would have to delete Enervation)

So, which one? One will drop a dragon, stopping it from flyby attacks and giving it some nice falling damage. The other would give everyone +4 to AC and +4 to all saving throws vs all attacks from dragons.

I can always ask for donations from you all to buy a scroll of AntiDragon Aura, which costs roughly 400gp for +2 to AC and saves, 700gp for +3 to AC and saves, and 1000gp for +4 to AC and saves. Divided by 4 of us, that's 250 a pop, which isn't that much for what it does.

[Deekin]

I would like to point out that My Char can do something very similar to wingbind, only it augments for higher DCs.

[Rojito]

Whats the xp req to go from level 13 to level 14?

[Deekin]

need 91,000 to hit level 14.

[Fangor the Fierce]

91000 to go level 14 from 13.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Again, can ANYONE answer the proverbial question of, 'What happens when a flying creature is flying at full speed and runs into an Invisible wall?' (Wall of Force)

[Deekin]

The DM. There are no rules for collision .

I'd treat it as if you have fallen a distance equal to a quarter of the fly speed you were moving at.

[Wicksy]

Force Cage would useful but it might not be big enough to trap the really large dragons.

[K Man]

fangor77 said:

Again, can ANYONE answer the proverbial question of, 'What happens when a flying creature is flying at full speed and runs into an Invisible wall?' (Wall of Force)

deekin said:

The DM. There are no rules for collision .

I'd treat it as if you have fallen a distance equal to a quarter of the fly speed you were moving at.

I've actually debated this with Japic--AT GREAT LENGTH-- when designing this game. We talked about the physics of flight, of threatening in 3D (which sparked the poll about it) etc. The best answer I could come up with is...

It depends.

It depends on whether the dragon has the Monstrous Feat, Hover. From SRD:

Hover [General]
Prerequisite
Fly speed.

Benefit
When flying, the creature can halt its forward motion and hover in place as a move action. It can then fly in any direction, including straight down or straight up, at half speed, regardless of its maneuverability.

...

If the dragon does have this feat, I imagine the scenario would run like this;

• Mage goes before Dragon and sets up invisible Wall of Force, or some other intangible barrier.
  
• Dragon goes next and simply takes a move action to freeze forward movement and hang there, possibly cast retributive spell or breathe a breath weapon. (It is doubtful that even the most experienced mage would beat a Dragon's senses and get the wall up unnoticed.)
  
• Mage shits pants and goes with plan B.
  

However, the idea of a Dragon (with usually a dozen or so feats to spare) that HASN'T taken Hover or Wingover is not impossible--just universally stupid. In that scenario, there are even more 'depends'.

If the dragon is more than 150ft in the air, it could just stall its flight and drop 150 that round. The next round, it just needs to make a DC 20 REF save to recover from the stall and resume flight. If it's less than 150ft, it would just crash into the ground or possibly have another feat to help it land safely.

If the dragon has time to manuever around (above, sides or below) the wall, it would attempt to do that. If it can get close to an edge, I would rule that the dragon could attempt to 'stick' to the sides of the wall with a REF save, taking minimal damage but hanging on the invisible wall in the air. If the wall is more than 10ft away, Wingover would be used to do a 180 degree flip.

In the unlikely scenario that the dragon does not have Hover, cannot stall its flight safely, AND cannot avoid the wall otherwise, I would think something similar to Deekin's ruling is fair. Damage based on speed at time of impact and size category, followed quickly by a REF Save to resume a stalled flight.

Though it would be funny to see in action if it worked, the probability of it actually happening just really makes it useless.

I'd go with a more DM-friendly spell like, 'Soram's Special Seasoning'...makes one PC per level taste like smoked ham or other flavored meat product in the event of probable consumption by a huge or larger Dragon.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Actually, as for the statement that it would not actually happen, here's my scenario, and shows that it IS possible...

Wendell is under the influence of Greater Invisibility. He readies an action to cast Wall of Force in the path of the dragon, when it is evident that the dragon is flying. Dragon's initiative, it can't see Wendell, as Wendell is standing still, and there is a battle underway, with foes left and right. Meals ready for snatching. He flies towards one of Wendells allies, and POOF, runs smack dab into an invisible wall of force.

So, ruling on that scenario? Wendell would ready the wall of force to go in front of the dragon, in its flight path, causing it to run ito it.

[K Man]

fangor77 said:

Actually, as for the statement that it would not actually happen, here's my scenario, and shows that it IS possible...

Wendell is under the influence of Greater Invisibility. He readies an action to cast Wall of Force in the path of the dragon, when it is evident that the dragon is flying. Dragon's initiative, it can't see Wendell, as Wendell is standing still, and there is a battle underway, with foes left and right. Meals ready for snatching. He flies towards one of Wendells allies, and POOF, runs smack dab into an invisible wall of force.

So, ruling on that scenario? Wendell would ready the wall of force to go in front of the dragon, in its flight path, causing it to run ito it.

If a caster were to ready a spell such as Wall of Force, I would see it running more like this;

• Caster readies, possible trigger: Dragon moves.
  
• Dragon "begins" movement. (I say begins because readying an action technically interrupts it and the cast spell goes off before the dragon actually moves).
  
• Caster casts spell.
  
• Dragon gets several chances to notice the wall going up. Be it the caster speaking the verbal components, moving for the somatic components, or just generally within range of vision - the Spot and Listen DC for this (while invisible) ranges from DC 0 to DC 45-ish or so, depending on max distance dragon can dive Vs. distance caster can cast Wall of Force.
  
• If those sense fail, the Dragon then gets a Spot Check DC 40 to see the wall before him. Remember, Invisible does not equal undetectable. From the SRD; "...An inanimate object, an unliving creature holding still, or a completely immobile creature is even harder to spot (DC 40)..." An invisible Wall of Force (I think) would certainly fall under inanimate object and immobile.
  
• Provided those checks fail, then it would resort to the ruling above about avoiding, hovering or stalling flight to not slam into the wall. The Dragon's movement is the trigger and the wall would prevent him being capable of continuing his listed action. From the SRD about Readying: "...Assuming he is still capable of doing so, he continues his actions once you complete your readied action..." So the dragon would be free to hover and avoid because he's incapable of continuing his actions.
  

I've been through most of these scenarios with Japic as I've mentioned, and we tried to think of every way a Dragon could be fooled into slamming into a Wall of Force. I'm open to discussing them all and have always advocated open discussion about rules with players.

[Fangor the Fierce]

Yes, Readied, but Readied to go up when dragon is within 60 feet of caster. (Max range for spell...) It would go like this... Wendell would ready his spell to go up when the dragon is 60 feet from him, 5 feet in front of his path. The dragon is actually in the process of his MOVE action, and the wall goes up. It interrupts his move action, causes him to make spot check for the wall, listen checks to hear the sorceror casting on the move (mobile spell casting to run around while casting, to throw dragon off a little on where Sorceror is standing), and even if it passes, the wall goes up, in front of the dragon. The way I see it, he still has some movement left, to try and get around/by the wall, if he spots it. Invisible wall, not moving, DC?? Either way, it interrupts his movement, and causes him to either turn in another direction, quickly, as the wall is 5 feet in front of him, or choose to Hover, which is another move action. It would cause the dragon to stop, and end its movement?

The key is readying the wall at a certain distance, not action of moving. Which is legal, right?